Everything Ulster - Latest comments on That 11 "Super Council" Deal

Seamus [Member] in response to: That 11 "Super Council" Deal

Seamus [Member] — Fri, 21 Mar 2008 20:23:17 +0000

If there where that many of them then it would appear on the census. When it comes to community background, it is about background. B.A.C.K.G.R.O.U.N.D. It is a simple way of defining people. Rightly or wrongly, that is how it is done. And these demographic figures of percieved community background are then further backed up in the Elections. According to the Census, which most people accept as being fairly accurate, 3.1% of the Population didn't have either a Catholic or Protestant background. [14.1% of the Population consider themselves not to be practicing Catholics or Protestants.]

Now, 43.8% of the population are fro ma Catholic Background, and 41.4% of the voters voted for either Sinn Féin or the SDLP. Not much of a difference there. There is a larger discrepincy in the Protestant vote, as parties like the Alliance Party tend to do better in Protestant areas.

Mike [Visitor] in response to: That 11 "Super Council" Deal

Mike [Visitor] — Fri, 21 Mar 2008 18:44:50 +0000

Atheists dont "practice their faith" because by definition they have no faith to practice. The Census agency can "percieve" and "consider" all they like but those of us who live in the real world know that the perceptions of those who ask atheists whether or not the God he or she doesnt believe in is represented by the pope should not be taken seriously. In any case anyone with a bit of sense will decline to answer the religion/race questions.

As for dismissng the 3% here or 5% there (figures presumably sourced from the top of your own head) have you ever heard of the concept of "balance of power" ? It also may have escaped your attention that there is an increacing population of individuals from outside of Northern Ireland now living here with no particular axe to grind regarding our 400 year old ethnic squabble. Which "community background" does one pigenhole these individuals into ?

Seamus [Member] in response to: That 11 "Super Council" Deal

Seamus [Member] — Fri, 21 Mar 2008 04:36:08 +0000

"And besides what do Atheists/Jews/Muslims/Hindus/Agnostics/Gay Buddhist Gypsies/etc "tend" to be ?"

I don't know why you listed Gay there, but for the rest, the % Catholic or Protestant is this whole perceived Community background that is used in the Census, so Catholics or Protestants who no longer practice their faith are still giving a community background, so an Atheist from the Falls Road, raised in a Catholic household, is considered to be from the Catholic community. The rest of them make up the 5% or so Others.

Seamus [Member] in response to: That 11 "Super Council" Deal

Seamus [Member] — Fri, 21 Mar 2008 04:32:27 +0000

They tend to be a very, very small section of the community. It is estimated that Protestants and Catholics who cross their political divide, while not completely unknown, only happen to make up about 2 or 3% of the population. For Demographics, which are fairly well backed up in the Elections, people normally quote the % of Protestants as Unionist, and the % of Catholics as Nationalist. There is a reason that the areas with the highest % of Catholics are dominated by Nationalist like West Belfast which is 82.68% Catholic elects 6 Nationalists, while East Belfast, which is 84.62% Protestant elected 5 Unionists and a watered down Unionist.

Mike [Visitor] in response to: That 11 "Super Council" Deal

Mike [Visitor] — Fri, 21 Mar 2008 02:49:19 +0000

Unionist Catholics and Nationalist Protestants are hardly completely unknown species all the same. Even if they are probably outnumbered by "dont give a fiddlers anywhich way" of either persuasion.

So while “most people who aren't completely retarded” might “know what they are saying”. Most people who aren't completely retarded know it’s a pile of steaming horse manure.

And besides what do Atheists/Jews/Muslims/Hindus/Agnostics/Gay Buddhist Gypsies/etc "tend" to be ?

Seamus [Member] in response to: That 11 "Super Council" Deal

Seamus [Member] — Fri, 21 Mar 2008 02:05:13 +0000

Um, Mike, I'm not sure if anyone has clued you in to the Politics here, but generally speaking, Protestants tend to be Unionist, while Catholics tend to be Nationalist. Everyone knows that and when people use the two terms interchangeably, most people, who aren't completely retarded, know what they are saying. Stop trying to be clever, you're only making a dick of yourself.

Mike [Visitor] in response to: That 11 "Super Council" Deal

Mike [Visitor] — Fri, 21 Mar 2008 01:59:52 +0000

"You stated that unionists in Derry will be even more marginilised ...... The new council will actually be 2.87% more Protestant, so there not exactly being more marginilised"

Who said anything about Protestants ? I thought we were talking about Unionists ???

Seamus [Member] in response to: That 11 "Super Council" Deal

Seamus [Member] — Thu, 20 Mar 2008 02:08:40 +0000

When I think of the diversity of the make up of Northern Ireland, I wasn't just hinting at the ethnic make-up, which is growing ever diverse. In terms of culture, nationality, religion, political opinion, and some many other things, the North is in my opinion, more diverse.

"I was thinking more along the lines of giving the existing MLAs more work to do."

What, like the devolution of Policing and Justice [wink, wink, nudge, nudge]?

Da [Visitor] in response to: That 11 "Super Council" Deal

Da [Visitor] — Thu, 20 Mar 2008 01:28:40 +0000

I hadn't necessarily looked to remove the councils AND reduce the number of MLAs, Seamus.
I was thinking more along the lines of giving the existing MLAs more work to do.
I wouldn't really agree that Northern Ireland has a more diverse population than the rest of the UK when you consider the ethnic make up of much of England in particular. I do agree, though, that it is important that minorities are heard - all the while bearing in mind their numbers in relation to the entire populous.
I don't think it is feasible that every minority can have an elected representative - possibly they need someone tasked to speak for them at Stormont when the need arises - and ideally not from the "are you an orange or a green hindu" lobby.

beano [Member] in response to: That 11 "Super Council" Deal

beano [Member] — Wed, 19 Mar 2008 15:54:28 +0000

Fair enough Seamus, I suppose it's just the image I have of Strabane (having had the misfortune of meeting one or two of its delinquent sons) of being devoid of anything but CIRA nutters. Silly really. Mea culpa.